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	<title>Comments on: A Questionable Schema</title>
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	<link>http://blog.coreknowledge.org/2012/11/12/a-questionable-schema/</link>
	<description>Closing the Achievement Gap: Teaching Content</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 20 May 2013 16:19:13 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Harold</title>
		<link>http://blog.coreknowledge.org/2012/11/12/a-questionable-schema/comment-page-1/#comment-22461</link>
		<dc:creator>Harold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Nov 2012 20:14:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.coreknowledge.org/?p=6146#comment-22461</guid>
		<description>First attested narrative ballad, I should have said. Aaron Copland used the melody in his haunting &quot;Lincoln Portrait.&quot;

The rationale for having kids read poetry and &quot;good&quot; literature was to provide them with what were considered the very best models. 

To give them inferior or trivial material to work with, such as the song mentioned above is akin to child-abuse, I believe. Anything we give them to sing or read or even ask them to make or do should be something of intrinsic value for them that they will treasure in years to come.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First attested narrative ballad, I should have said. Aaron Copland used the melody in his haunting &#8220;Lincoln Portrait.&#8221;</p>
<p>The rationale for having kids read poetry and &#8220;good&#8221; literature was to provide them with what were considered the very best models. </p>
<p>To give them inferior or trivial material to work with, such as the song mentioned above is akin to child-abuse, I believe. Anything we give them to sing or read or even ask them to make or do should be something of intrinsic value for them that they will treasure in years to come.</p>
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		<title>By: Harold</title>
		<link>http://blog.coreknowledge.org/2012/11/12/a-questionable-schema/comment-page-1/#comment-22460</link>
		<dc:creator>Harold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Nov 2012 20:04:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.coreknowledge.org/?p=6146#comment-22460</guid>
		<description>On Springfield Mountain there did dwell
A lovely youth, I loved him well.
Too-roo-dee-loo, too-roo-dee-ay,
Too-roo-dee-loo, too-roo-dee-ay.

One Monday morning he did go
Down to the meadow for to mow (etc.).

He had not mowed half &#039;round the field
When a pesky serpent bit at his heel.

They took him home to Molly dear,
Which made him feel so very queer.

Now Molly had two ruby lips
With which the pizen she did sip.

She also had a rotten tooth,
And so the pizen it killed them both.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>On Springfield Mountain there did dwell<br />
A lovely youth, I loved him well.<br />
Too-roo-dee-loo, too-roo-dee-ay,<br />
Too-roo-dee-loo, too-roo-dee-ay.</p>
<p>One Monday morning he did go<br />
Down to the meadow for to mow (etc.).</p>
<p>He had not mowed half &#8217;round the field<br />
When a pesky serpent bit at his heel.</p>
<p>They took him home to Molly dear,<br />
Which made him feel so very queer.</p>
<p>Now Molly had two ruby lips<br />
With which the pizen she did sip.</p>
<p>She also had a rotten tooth,<br />
And so the pizen it killed them both.</p>
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		<title>By: Harold</title>
		<link>http://blog.coreknowledge.org/2012/11/12/a-questionable-schema/comment-page-1/#comment-22459</link>
		<dc:creator>Harold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Nov 2012 20:02:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.coreknowledge.org/?p=6146#comment-22459</guid>
		<description>&quot;Clementine&quot; is not a grisly song - it is a parody - like slapstick or Warner Bros. cartoons It resembles &quot;Springfield Mountain&quot; - the first attested American folk song, which was popularized on the Boston vaudeville stage and which spoofed a real incident. I think such songs are more appropriate for third or fourth grader myself, rather than second graders. Very young children don&#039;t really &quot;get&quot; parody, but older ones love it. 

Still both these songs have much to recommend them as part of the American musical heritage, as it were. They also function as memory &quot;hooks to hang your hat on&quot; -- when you come to learn real history - about the gold rush or the puritan settlers of Massachusetts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Clementine&#8221; is not a grisly song &#8211; it is a parody &#8211; like slapstick or Warner Bros. cartoons It resembles &#8220;Springfield Mountain&#8221; &#8211; the first attested American folk song, which was popularized on the Boston vaudeville stage and which spoofed a real incident. I think such songs are more appropriate for third or fourth grader myself, rather than second graders. Very young children don&#8217;t really &#8220;get&#8221; parody, but older ones love it. </p>
<p>Still both these songs have much to recommend them as part of the American musical heritage, as it were. They also function as memory &#8220;hooks to hang your hat on&#8221; &#8212; when you come to learn real history &#8211; about the gold rush or the puritan settlers of Massachusetts.</p>
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		<title>By: Harold</title>
		<link>http://blog.coreknowledge.org/2012/11/12/a-questionable-schema/comment-page-1/#comment-22278</link>
		<dc:creator>Harold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Nov 2012 21:09:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.coreknowledge.org/?p=6146#comment-22278</guid>
		<description>Ruth Seeger&#039;s transcriptions were also the source for Aaron Copeland&#039;s &quot;Hoedown&quot; in his Billy the Kid ballet suite.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ruth Seeger&#8217;s transcriptions were also the source for Aaron Copeland&#8217;s &#8220;Hoedown&#8221; in his Billy the Kid ballet suite.</p>
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		<title>By: Harold</title>
		<link>http://blog.coreknowledge.org/2012/11/12/a-questionable-schema/comment-page-1/#comment-22277</link>
		<dc:creator>Harold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Nov 2012 20:44:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.coreknowledge.org/?p=6146#comment-22277</guid>
		<description>Hooray for folk music! Good for teaching cultural context, language enrichment, and last but not least, music instruction (which in turn is very good for mathematics). 

The very best are the collections for children compiled by the distinguished American avant guard composer Ruth Crawford Seeger (Pete Seeger&#039;s stepmother), who also wrote extensively on how folk songs should be used as pedagogy. 

Ruth Crawford Seeger&#039;s work is curently used in the American Kodaly method of teaching music. The Kodaly method was developed in Hungary and aadapted by one of his followers in Finland. It is also being adopted by Singapore.

No need to reinvent the wheel when the very best have already won world-wide recognition and been used for decades.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hooray for folk music! Good for teaching cultural context, language enrichment, and last but not least, music instruction (which in turn is very good for mathematics). </p>
<p>The very best are the collections for children compiled by the distinguished American avant guard composer Ruth Crawford Seeger (Pete Seeger&#8217;s stepmother), who also wrote extensively on how folk songs should be used as pedagogy. </p>
<p>Ruth Crawford Seeger&#8217;s work is curently used in the American Kodaly method of teaching music. The Kodaly method was developed in Hungary and aadapted by one of his followers in Finland. It is also being adopted by Singapore.</p>
<p>No need to reinvent the wheel when the very best have already won world-wide recognition and been used for decades.</p>
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		<title>By: momof4</title>
		<link>http://blog.coreknowledge.org/2012/11/12/a-questionable-schema/comment-page-1/#comment-22275</link>
		<dc:creator>momof4</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Nov 2012 20:26:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.coreknowledge.org/?p=6146#comment-22275</guid>
		<description>I should have checked before posting - a number of the Wee Sing CDs are available, in combination with a book - from the B&amp;N description, the books have some extras, in addition to song lyrics (and music?). Wee Sing America has Preamble to Constitution, Gettysburg Address etc. They are now on my to-buy list for the grandkids!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I should have checked before posting &#8211; a number of the Wee Sing CDs are available, in combination with a book &#8211; from the B&amp;N description, the books have some extras, in addition to song lyrics (and music?). Wee Sing America has Preamble to Constitution, Gettysburg Address etc. They are now on my to-buy list for the grandkids!</p>
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		<title>By: momof4</title>
		<link>http://blog.coreknowledge.org/2012/11/12/a-questionable-schema/comment-page-1/#comment-22273</link>
		<dc:creator>momof4</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Nov 2012 20:19:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.coreknowledge.org/?p=6146#comment-22273</guid>
		<description>My kids had various Wee Sing tapes (now avail on CD?), which had many of the songs mentioned. Wee Sing, America had the patriotic songs, Anchors Aweigh, the Marine Hymn etc. They were great sing-alongs in the car. I still have - transposed onto the computer and ipod - a number of Sing Along with Mitch Miller and the Gang records, which also have these and other classic folk songs. They&#039;re not nearly as well-known, but Johnny Horton recorded a number of songs with historical themes; Battle of New Orleans, Sink the Bismarck, Johnny Reb, North to Alaska (gold rush) etc. and they&#039;re available on CD. All of these can be used by regular teachers, as many schools don&#039;t have music teachers. My regular teachers did this and would have been insulted by the idea that they could/would not include this. (same for art/architecture history)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My kids had various Wee Sing tapes (now avail on CD?), which had many of the songs mentioned. Wee Sing, America had the patriotic songs, Anchors Aweigh, the Marine Hymn etc. They were great sing-alongs in the car. I still have &#8211; transposed onto the computer and ipod &#8211; a number of Sing Along with Mitch Miller and the Gang records, which also have these and other classic folk songs. They&#8217;re not nearly as well-known, but Johnny Horton recorded a number of songs with historical themes; Battle of New Orleans, Sink the Bismarck, Johnny Reb, North to Alaska (gold rush) etc. and they&#8217;re available on CD. All of these can be used by regular teachers, as many schools don&#8217;t have music teachers. My regular teachers did this and would have been insulted by the idea that they could/would not include this. (same for art/architecture history)</p>
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		<title>By: Amy R.</title>
		<link>http://blog.coreknowledge.org/2012/11/12/a-questionable-schema/comment-page-1/#comment-22247</link>
		<dc:creator>Amy R.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2012 17:03:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.coreknowledge.org/?p=6146#comment-22247</guid>
		<description>American folk songs are not too grisly for American children. It&#039;s the same principle oft cited when discussing the value of fairy tales: The child knows there&#039;s a dragon. What he needs is St. George. 

Children are aware of the major themes of life, no matter how much the adults would like to shield them from sin and darkness. The children know about the sin and darkness because they live here,and they are vastly helped by processing their fears and feelings through singing with adults. A child is better prepared for the death of his beloved pet if he&#039;s familiar with &#039;Go Tell Aunt Rhody.&#039; He&#039;s better prepared for a funeral if he is used to hearing his mother sing, &#039;Train is A-Coming,&#039; or &#039;Swing Low, Sweet Chariot.&#039; My own children have weathered very hard economic times through the help of such songs as &#039;Hard Times Come Again No More,&#039; and &#039;Life, Let Us Cherish.&#039; In the 1970&#039;s recession I heard my own mother sing, &#039;Gospel Plow,&#039; and we all learned together to &#039;keep your hand on the plow, hold on, hold on.&#039;

American folk songs are full of the stuff of life--love, death, marriage, revenge, motherhood, travel, patriotism, loss, hope, joy...and they also contain a tremendous amount of historical context.

I have always been glad to see traditional American folk songs in the Core Knowledge curriculum. They are the American child&#039;s birthright, in my opinion, and I&#039;m sorry for any children who find themselves bereft of the rich language and interesting imagery of folk songs. 

My husband and I are folk musicians. Our four sons are musicians, as well. We sing traditional music and play dulcimer, banjo, fiddle, mandolin, autoharp, and guitar. We give small performances in our city, in an effort to keep this humble part of our musical heritage alive.

I just can&#039;t believe American second graders are singing about &#039;building schema&#039; to the tune of Clementine. Give them Clementine.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>American folk songs are not too grisly for American children. It&#8217;s the same principle oft cited when discussing the value of fairy tales: The child knows there&#8217;s a dragon. What he needs is St. George. </p>
<p>Children are aware of the major themes of life, no matter how much the adults would like to shield them from sin and darkness. The children know about the sin and darkness because they live here,and they are vastly helped by processing their fears and feelings through singing with adults. A child is better prepared for the death of his beloved pet if he&#8217;s familiar with &#8216;Go Tell Aunt Rhody.&#8217; He&#8217;s better prepared for a funeral if he is used to hearing his mother sing, &#8216;Train is A-Coming,&#8217; or &#8216;Swing Low, Sweet Chariot.&#8217; My own children have weathered very hard economic times through the help of such songs as &#8216;Hard Times Come Again No More,&#8217; and &#8216;Life, Let Us Cherish.&#8217; In the 1970&#8242;s recession I heard my own mother sing, &#8216;Gospel Plow,&#8217; and we all learned together to &#8216;keep your hand on the plow, hold on, hold on.&#8217;</p>
<p>American folk songs are full of the stuff of life&#8211;love, death, marriage, revenge, motherhood, travel, patriotism, loss, hope, joy&#8230;and they also contain a tremendous amount of historical context.</p>
<p>I have always been glad to see traditional American folk songs in the Core Knowledge curriculum. They are the American child&#8217;s birthright, in my opinion, and I&#8217;m sorry for any children who find themselves bereft of the rich language and interesting imagery of folk songs. </p>
<p>My husband and I are folk musicians. Our four sons are musicians, as well. We sing traditional music and play dulcimer, banjo, fiddle, mandolin, autoharp, and guitar. We give small performances in our city, in an effort to keep this humble part of our musical heritage alive.</p>
<p>I just can&#8217;t believe American second graders are singing about &#8216;building schema&#8217; to the tune of Clementine. Give them Clementine.</p>
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		<title>By: Singing &#8217;bout my schema — Joanne Jacobs</title>
		<link>http://blog.coreknowledge.org/2012/11/12/a-questionable-schema/comment-page-1/#comment-22242</link>
		<dc:creator>Singing &#8217;bout my schema — Joanne Jacobs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2012 14:28:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.coreknowledge.org/?p=6146#comment-22242</guid>
		<description>[...] second graders sing the “Background Knowledge Song” to the tune of Clementine. Does singing about &#8220;schema&#8221; help second graders understand what they read? Core Knowledge Blog&#8217;s Robert Pondiscio is [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] second graders sing the “Background Knowledge Song” to the tune of Clementine. Does singing about &#8220;schema&#8221; help second graders understand what they read? Core Knowledge Blog&#8217;s Robert Pondiscio is [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Cassyt</title>
		<link>http://blog.coreknowledge.org/2012/11/12/a-questionable-schema/comment-page-1/#comment-22215</link>
		<dc:creator>Cassyt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2012 01:11:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.coreknowledge.org/?p=6146#comment-22215</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m torn. I was in a first grade classroom where a first grader, when asked how she new the answer to 7 + 8, replied &quot;I used automaticity.&quot; She knew what the term meant and understood the difference between using a make ten strategy and having worked so much with it that  7 + 8 was now a fact for her.

On the other hand, I was in a different 1st grade classroom where the the kid used the term &quot;com-moo-tive&quot; property, which I&#039;m pretty sure he didn&#039;t totally understand. Why not just call it &quot;Any Order&quot;?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m torn. I was in a first grade classroom where a first grader, when asked how she new the answer to 7 + 8, replied &#8220;I used automaticity.&#8221; She knew what the term meant and understood the difference between using a make ten strategy and having worked so much with it that  7 + 8 was now a fact for her.</p>
<p>On the other hand, I was in a different 1st grade classroom where the the kid used the term &#8220;com-moo-tive&#8221; property, which I&#8217;m pretty sure he didn&#8217;t totally understand. Why not just call it &#8220;Any Order&#8221;?</p>
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